Tonight on #mochat we talked about the conflict between art and commercial work. A lot of varying definitions of art and a lot of fuzzy lines. I’d like to say there was a lot of consensus on the topic, but everyone’s opinions varied. One thing we did seem to agree on is that we all have a need to be creative whether from solving client problems or creating something of lasting value.
Transcript
- 9:00PM EDT August 27, 2013
Motion Chat@MotionChat
Welcome to #mochat everyone! Tonight we’re talking about work as art vs commercial products.
- 9:00PM EDT August 27, 2013
Motion Chat@MotionChat
If you’re new to #mochat, you can read more at motionleague.com/mochatMain thing is to remember to include the hashtag.
- 9:02PM EDT August 27, 2013
Motion Chat@MotionChat
We like to experiment, create meaning, and make an impact. But how much is art? Especially with clients over our shoulders? #mochat
- 9:04PM EDT August 27, 2013
Paul Conigliaro@conigs
@MotionChat Not to get too deep into meaning of art… client work can be creative, but isn’t art. Personal projects can be. #mochat
- 9:07PM EDT August 27, 2013
Tom Daigon@lasvideo
Maybe operating definitions are needed for both words so we are all talking the same meaning here. #mochat
- 9:07PM EDT August 27, 2013
Paul Conigliaro@conigs
- 9:08PM EDT August 27, 2013
Charles Rowland@RagingClaw
@conigs @MotionChat i can’t call anything a client wants art, because it never ends up what i envisioned cause of their… input #mochat
- 9:09PM EDT August 27, 2013
Ronn Trevino @rovino
hello party people.. #mochat
- 9:09PM EDT August 27, 2013
Paul Conigliaro@conigs
@RagingClaw I know @bran_dj mentioned something a while ago about not relying on clients for creative art, instead do personal work. #mochat
- 9:09PM EDT August 27, 2013
Paul Conigliaro@conigs
- 9:10PM EDT August 27, 2013
Motion Chat@MotionChat
“@eyedesyn: @conigs @MotionChat I think video as an art form is a concept that is very new to the world of art to begin with.” #mochat
- 9:10PM EDT August 27, 2013
Paul Conigliaro@conigs
- 9:10PM EDT August 27, 2013
Paul Conigliaro@conigs
@RagingClaw @lasvideo I’m not even going to wrap that tweet in the #mochat tag.
- 9:11PM EDT August 27, 2013
Paul Conigliaro@conigs
Does anyone have examples of client/commercial work they would hold up as being considered art? And why? #mochat
- 9:12PM EDT August 27, 2013
Paul Conigliaro@conigs
@eyedesyn @RagingClaw @bran_dj But how much of that was done with their client over their shoulder dictating color, timing, etc? #mochat
- 9:12PM EDT August 27, 2013
Mike Florio@mrmikeflorio
- 9:12PM EDT August 27, 2013
Motion Chat@MotionChat
Hey everyone. Remember to add this to your tweet -> #mochat
- 9:12PM EDT August 27, 2013
Ronn Trevino @rovino
RMT @MotionChat: “@eyedesyn: @conigs “video as an art form…new to the world of art.” #mochat w/ that in mind name some video art. #mochat
- 9:12PM EDT August 27, 2013
Charles Rowland@RagingClaw
- 9:12PM EDT August 27, 2013
Dave Glanz@daveglanz
- 9:12PM EDT August 27, 2013
Paul Conigliaro@conigs
@RagingClaw “Can you warm up that blue? It just feels so cold.” #mochat #mochat
- 9:13PM EDT August 27, 2013
Paul Conigliaro@conigs
@daveglanz Technique as art, definitely. And that brings about an entirely different angle on the discussion. #mochat
- 9:13PM EDT August 27, 2013
Charles Rowland@RagingClaw
- 9:13PM EDT August 27, 2013
Paul Conigliaro@conigs
@daveglanz Actually, managing clients can be an art form, too. #mochat
- 9:14PM EDT August 27, 2013
Dave Glanz@daveglanz
- 9:14PM EDT August 27, 2013
Charles Rowland@RagingClaw
gotta go peeps! crap! #mochat
- 9:15PM EDT August 27, 2013
Paul Conigliaro@conigs
@RagingClaw Miss you! #mochat
- 9:15PM EDT August 27, 2013
Tom Daigon@lasvideo
Like I said. We must define what art is before we can broaden the discussion. #mochat
- 9:16PM EDT August 27, 2013
Clever Mammals@CleverMammals
@mrmikeflorio @conigs Check this one out. Brand new commercial out of Assembly in Auckland NZ #mochat vimeo.com/73094973
- 9:16PM EDT August 27, 2013
Isaac Light@IsaacLight_
- 9:18PM EDT August 27, 2013
Paul Conigliaro@conigs
- 9:18PM EDT August 27, 2013
Dave Glanz@daveglanz
- 9:19PM EDT August 27, 2013
Ronn Trevino @rovino
Any mograph piece can be considered art.. once its use is meant to gain, motivate or entice for commercial gain… its def changes #mochat
- 9:19PM EDT August 27, 2013
Tom Daigon@lasvideo
Like the Supreme Court judge said when asked what porn is “I know it when I see it”. 😀 #mochat
- 9:20PM EDT August 27, 2013
SocialWorldBuzz@SocialWorldBuzz
Checking out • Tuesday’s ✓ #MoChat — discussion for Motion Designers ▸ 29:00 ET
- 9:20PM EDT August 27, 2013
Paul Conigliaro@conigs
- 9:20PM EDT August 27, 2013
Dave Glanz@daveglanz
so we can look back at commissioned work, like the titles for “Seven” or Michelangelo’s work and it’s easy to call it “art” #mochat
- 9:21PM EDT August 27, 2013
Paul Conigliaro@conigs
@daveglanz In those cases, how much wis directed by studios, though? Commissioned but free direction is rare in mograph. #mochat
- 9:21PM EDT August 27, 2013
Ronn Trevino @rovino
- 9:21PM EDT August 27, 2013
Tom Daigon@lasvideo
I think Saul Basses movie mographs would fit my definition of art. #mochat
- 9:22PM EDT August 27, 2013
Tom Daigon@lasvideo
I have 1 or 2 clients that are on the same frequency as me and we inspire each other to create “art”. #mochat
- 9:23PM EDT August 27, 2013
Paul Conigliaro@conigs
- 9:24PM EDT August 27, 2013
Motion Chat@MotionChat
“@BettyChinWu: Art=when I’m given the freedom to stir a reaction creatively, make an impression, without any deadline or client” #mochat
- 9:25PM EDT August 27, 2013
Paul Conigliaro@conigs
@bran_dj @RagingClaw That might have been it. #mochat
- 9:26PM EDT August 27, 2013
Tom Daigon@lasvideo
Subjectivity makes empirical discussion difficult. One mans art is another mans fart 😀 #mochat
- 9:26PM EDT August 27, 2013
Dave Glanz@daveglanz
I think another important question here is, does our work *have* to be art? I’d say in most cases, no. #mochat
- 9:27PM EDT August 27, 2013
Paul Conigliaro@conigs
- 9:27PM EDT August 27, 2013
Ronn Trevino @rovino
MT @daveglanz: …does our work *have* to be art? I’d say in most cases, no. #mochat seen my work huh? 8) #mochat
- 9:27PM EDT August 27, 2013
Paul Conigliaro@conigs
@daveglanz Not for the job, no. But I think as an individual in a creative field, we need something that feeds the right brain. #mochat
- 9:28PM EDT August 27, 2013
EJ Hassenfratz@eyedesyn
@MotionChat @BettyChinWu there’s so much art out there that was made for a client & had deadlines. Being an artist is a job too! #mochat
- 9:28PM EDT August 27, 2013
Betty Chin-Wu@BettyChinWu
@MotionChat But when given limitations, and a problem to solve, that’s more design, less artistic freedom. Great topic! Have fun #mochat
- 9:29PM EDT August 27, 2013
Dave Glanz@daveglanz
- 9:29PM EDT August 27, 2013
William J. Meyer@robotika_org
@conigs The BMW shorts from awhile back. Similarily, the @RedGiantNews films. B/C they can transcend their function of selling. #mochat
- 9:29PM EDT August 27, 2013
Paul Conigliaro@conigs
If I had to define the two, I’d say art is about creating meaning, design is about solving problems. And there’s a mix. #mochat
- 9:29PM EDT August 27, 2013
Ronn Trevino @rovino
@BettyChinWu its those limitations and problems that lend to creativity.. is that not the essence of art? #mochat
- 9:29PM EDT August 27, 2013
Mike Florio@mrmikeflorio
@daveglanz this statement holds alot of weight:some of it’s for the meal some of it’s for the reel #mochat
- 9:30PM EDT August 27, 2013
Paul Conigliaro@conigs
@robotika_org That’s a good point. Pieces that can move being simply peddling wares are more on the art side of the scales. #mochat
- 9:30PM EDT August 27, 2013
Jerome Green@floppinharry
“@daveglanz: I think another important question here is, does our work *have* to be art? I’d say in most cases, no. #mochat” I’d agree
- 9:30PM EDT August 27, 2013
Paul Slemmer@paulslemmer
I think this is why we call our work design. The goals are form and function, not artistic expression. #mochat
- 9:30PM EDT August 27, 2013
Tom Daigon@lasvideo
I aspire to good works with clients. At home exploring techniques I feel closer to making art. #mochat
- 9:30PM EDT August 27, 2013
Dave Glanz@daveglanz
@mrmikeflorio is now the Don King of mograph. #mochat
- 9:31PM EDT August 27, 2013
Ronn Trevino @rovino
@daveglanz thats Mr Don King to you… 8) #mochat
- 9:32PM EDT August 27, 2013
danny princz@rendernyc
Driving atm so won’t make #mochat but pulled over. Please check Harry Franks medical fund page. Help out if u can giveforward.com/fundraiser/66y…
- 9:33PM EDT August 27, 2013
Paul Conigliaro@conigs
“You shouldn’t be looking for your own personal artistic satisfaction from client work.” – Orion Tait, Buck vimeo.com/70642037 #mochat
- 9:33PM EDT August 27, 2013
Dave Glanz@daveglanz
@mrmikeflorio hah! It’s the rhyming! #mochat
- 9:33PM EDT August 27, 2013
Paul Conigliaro@conigs
Last tweet courtesy of @bran_dj. twitter.com/bran_dj/status… #mochat
- 9:35PM EDT August 27, 2013
Dave Glanz@daveglanz
@rendernyc @graymachine is almost 90 percent funded. #mochat
- 9:32PM EDT August 27, 2013
danny princz@rendernyc
Driving atm so won’t make #mochat but pulled over. Please check Harry Franks medical fund page. Help out if u can giveforward.com/fundraiser/66y…
Retweeted by Bran - 9:35PM EDT August 27, 2013
Paul Conigliaro@conigs
@daveglanz @rendernyc @graymachine So happy to see that it’s almost there. #mochat
- 9:36PM EDT August 27, 2013
Paul Conigliaro@conigs
What do you do for creative freedom/art if your day job is client work? #mochat
- 9:36PM EDT August 27, 2013
Dave Glanz@daveglanz
@rendernyc in other words, big pat on the back to this community for pitching in! Warms the heart. #mochat
- 9:38PM EDT August 27, 2013
Dave Glanz@daveglanz
- 9:39PM EDT August 27, 2013
Seth Eckert@seth_eckert
@paulslemmer agreed! #mochat
- 9:40PM EDT August 27, 2013
Ronn Trevino @rovino
RT @conigs: What do you do for creative freedom/art if your day job is client work? #mochat does BeAtBoXing count? #phhffttttbopbop #mochat
- 9:41PM EDT August 27, 2013
EJ Hassenfratz@eyedesyn
@BettyChinWu I think when you are good enough to have clients work with you on some of your own terms, that’s when art can happen #mochat
- 9:41PM EDT August 27, 2013
Paul Conigliaro@conigs
@bridgewindsoup @eyedesyn @RagingClaw @bran_dj Few lines are hard, but there’s some that definitely fall to either side. #mochat
- 9:41PM EDT August 27, 2013
Thom May@bridgewindsoup
@eyedesyn @conigs @RagingClaw @bran_dj everything has a prompt #mochat
- 9:41PM EDT August 27, 2013
Seth Eckert@seth_eckert
- 9:42PM EDT August 27, 2013
Betty Chin-Wu@BettyChinWu
- 9:42PM EDT August 27, 2013
Seth Eckert@seth_eckert
- 9:43PM EDT August 27, 2013
Betty Chin-Wu@BettyChinWu
- 9:30PM EDT August 27, 2013
Tom Daigon@lasvideo
I aspire to good works with clients. At home exploring techniques I feel closer to making art. #mochat
Retweeted by Seth Eckert - 9:43PM EDT August 27, 2013
Paul Slemmer@paulslemmer
A possibly dangerous fallacy is that creative fulfillment is only found in art. Client work often forces creativity. #mochat
- 9:44PM EDT August 27, 2013
Paul Conigliaro@conigs
@paulslemmer True. Creativity can be found in many things, not just art. #mochat
- 9:45PM EDT August 27, 2013
Victoria@FakeGreenDress
@paulslemmer Think you’re dead on. The best is when client stuff is interesting work I’d never think to do on my own. #mochat
- 9:46PM EDT August 27, 2013
craigwhitaker@qsjcraig
What’s up y’all #mochat
- 9:47PM EDT August 27, 2013
Tom Daigon@lasvideo
ART!! #mochat
- 9:48PM EDT August 27, 2013
Victoria@FakeGreenDress
@conigs Doing non-animation creative stuff helps and doesn’t feel like more work. I host a history podcast called @ahappening. #mochat
- 9:48PM EDT August 27, 2013
Seth Eckert@seth_eckert
Creativity in making complexity simple grants the most fulfillment to me. Collaboration is also one of my favorite things to do #mochat
- 9:49PM EDT August 27, 2013
Shinsuke Matsumoto@beatgram
@paulslemmer @conigs The art is awesome. But the art isn’t everything. I wanna be an artist though. #mochat
- 9:50PM EDT August 27, 2013
Tom Daigon@lasvideo
Art is a result of the creative process. But all creativity is not art 😀 #mochat
- 9:52PM EDT August 27, 2013
Betty Chin-Wu@BettyChinWu
- 9:54PM EDT August 27, 2013
Charles Rowland@RagingClaw
@bridgewindsoup @eyedesyn @conigs @bran_dj I’ve been looking into getting some prints for the walls. ando hiroshige is a fav #mochat
- 9:55PM EDT August 27, 2013
Motion Chat@MotionChat
5 minutes left of #mochat!
- 010:00PM EDT August 27, 2013
Motion Chat@MotionChat
And that about does it for tonight. Thanks for coming out for #mochat everyone. And as always, #GoMakeSomething.